On Wed, Jul 12, 2006 at 03:50:12PM -0700, Darcy Buskermolen wrote:
> On Wednesday 12 July 2006 14:46, elein wrote:
> > On Wed, Jul 12, 2006 at 09:20:59PM +0000, Christopher Browne wrote:
> > > elein wrote:
> > > > On Wed, Jul 12, 2006 at 08:30:51PM +0000, Christopher Browne wrote:
> > > >> Brad Nicholson wrote:
> > > >>> Christopher Browne wrote:
> > > >>>> * There is interest in the perl tools to keep a buffer for the
> > > >>>> general community between admin and the guts of Slony.
> > > >>>>
> > > >>>> (cbb: Is there interest in *working on* the Perl tools? As an OSS
> > > >>>> project, there is a need for volunteers. In the case of the Perl
> > > >>>> tools, past volunteers have stepped away, so we kind of need new
> > > >>>> ones...)
> > > >>>
> > > >>> Was there any discussion as to what area the perl tools were lacking
> > > >>> in?
> > > >
> > > > Yes.  I added my two bits regarding that they must be properly
> > > > maintained and better documented.
> > > >
> > > > I am considering writing the howto for slony administration using the
> > > > processes I use for perltools.   These would be task oriented rather
> > > > than the nuts and bolts documentation required by the development
> > > > team.  There is no "dba off the streets" level of documentation, imho,
> > > > except the little I've written so far.
> > > >
> > > > Should I take this on as a pgfoundry project or just rework the
> > > > how to documents?  I don't want to step on toes or to eliminate the
> > > > nuts and bolts documentation we already have.
> > >
> > > There is a section with a "task orientation"; we started by constructing
> > > a list of "seemingly interesting" tasks on the Wiki
> > > <http://slony-wiki.dbitech.ca/index.php/Howto>, and I took the results,
> > > extended them, and put that into the admin guide; see the CVS pointer
> > > <http://gborg.postgresql.org/cgi-bin/cvsweb.cgi/slony1-engine/doc/admingu
> > >ide/addthings.sgml?rev=1.17;content-type=text%2Fplain;cvsroot=slony1;only_
> > >with_tag=HEAD>
> > >
> > > It would seem to me that extending that would make the documentation set
> > > more complete, and the ability to interlink inside the one document
> > > seems valuable too.
> > >
> > > There is certainly benefit in adding material there; you can link to the
> > > Slonik reference guide (the existing material points to the manual pages
> > > pretty extensively), as well as to material elsewhere.  The material I
> > > put in didn't make reference to any of the altperl tools, but you'd
> > > certainly be able to <xref> to them, which would make it more valuable
> > > to beef up the altperl documentation as well...
> >
> > The point of what I could write is that it is from the dba on the street
> > perpective, rather than the slony task perspective.  You are working, as
> > you should be, on a slony task level.  The higher level would be more like:
> >  Why do you want a replica?  A recommended environment set up technique
> > which uses perltools. How to fix your db so it has PKs and UI and why. What
> > is failover (as opposed to move set)?  These are off the top of my head.
> > But I go over each step carefully with every client that I've set up slony.
> >
> > At some point, many of my clients get down to the level of the slony
> > documentation but certainly not all of them.  But in order to get there,
> > the non-trivial understanding and set up needs to be covered in a language
> > that they understand.
> >
> > So this will not be in the same style at all as what is there already.  But
> > I like the idea of being able to cross reference.  Perhaps a large addendum
> > tutorial document would be appropriate instead of changing the existing
> > work?
> >
> > BTW I have accidently found myself on the wiki for the howto several times,
> >  Shouldn't the link be more prominent?  I would need cvs privileges in
> > order to change the sgml, but it may be possible to funnel that through
> > fetter or some other committer.
> >
> > I'd like to hear concerns about too many documentation branches as well as
> > real life problems that people have run into when setting up and
> > administering slony.
> 
> The wiki really was setup to facilitate works in progress by developers, and 
> those close to the community, once done they should be marked that way and 
> url's provided to the real documentation.  (I updated a few on the wiki to 
> point at final docs already this afternoon)
> 

Then perhaps I can set up a wiki project for (A DBA Tutorial?) to start this 
documentation.  Unfortunately I cannot seem to request a login on the wiki.  
Can someone help? 

Does anyone disagree?  I do plan on lifting as necessary both from 
my previously published writings as well as the existing How To by Darcy, et al.  
I currently store this stuff in my project tools and what memory my brain
allows me.

--elein
elein at varlena.com


> 
> 
> >
> > --elein
> > elein at varlena.com
> >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Slony1-general mailing list
> > > Slony1-general at gborg.postgresql.org
> > > http://gborg.postgresql.org/mailman/listinfo/slony1-general
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Slony1-general mailing list
> > Slony1-general at gborg.postgresql.org
> > http://gborg.postgresql.org/mailman/listinfo/slony1-general
> 
> -- 
> Darcy Buskermolen
> Wavefire Technologies Corp.
> 
> http://www.wavefire.com
> ph: 250.717.0200
> fx: 250.763.1759
>